Episode 47: Making Friends in a New City

We've had loads of requests to talk about our experience of moving to a new city and navigating all the loneliness and out-of-place feelings. We're sharing about what helped us feel at home in new places and all the ups and downs of being somewhere new.

We have an episode about cross-cultural living that is slightly different to what we’re going to talk about today, but you can listen to that episode here.

We talk about how to make friends when you can’t afford to go out, different ways we found success making friends in a new city.

And if you’ve got good advice about how to make friends as a parent in a new city then please email us at hello@makinganeffortpodcast.com OR comment below.

Talk to you next week!

>>> Click here to read the computer generated transcript (note that the transcript isn't perfect)

Gabby: Welcome to the making an effort podcast, the podcast where you get to sit in on a conversation between. To friends discussing all the things they make an effort with and some of the things they don't. And this week we are going to be talking about our best tips and advice, and maybe just a few stories about moving to a new place. Um, this kind of came up because last fall, we put out a call about what you guys wanted us to talk about in podcast episodes and resoundingly. This topic came up over and over and over and over again. Um, and so we have done quite a bit of moving in our time and we thought, you know, we're not the experts. We can definitely talk these things through and share a few things we've learned along the way. And yeah, it'll be a good episode.

Mel: Yeah. I think we did cover a bunch of stuff in a previous episode, a bite like that, like the places that we've moved to and like what it was like. Moving to a different culture and stuff like that. But I think what we want to talk about today, More, so is like, how to feel settled, especially I think as an adult, I don't know about you, but I guess that's what I'm thinking about is the moving and going to new places that I've done as an adult and what that's been like in terms of settling in and making friends and feeling at home. Um, because it's really hard. I think, you know, like if there's something. Really excited about being in a nucleus. But I think once the initial, I don't know about you, but I find this like once the initial excitement of that, uh, the novelty of that wears off and you kind of realize,

Gabby: yeah, you're in a new place, you're in

Mel: a new place and you don't know where everything is or everyone, uh, you know, who people are. Um, it can be pretty overwhelming. Um, yeah.

Gabby: So that episode about, uh, cross-cultural living that if you want to tune in to that episode and hear our stories about where we've lived and all of that is episode 25. And I think what you're saying Maui too, is that this, um, Like it ties into like making friends. Right. And actually I was doing a little bit of research the other week and I noticed that our most downloaded episodes. To date is the making friends as an adult one over the, the purity culture, one over everything that episode gets got the most listens. And I think that's, there's a reason for that. And it's because it is hard to make friends as an adult and it's exponentially harder when you're in a new location and you're starting from scratch and it is super overwhelming. So, um, yeah. I think this is a great topic to talk about.

Mel: So what's it been like for you? So you, like, what are you thinking about. University. Are you thinking about when you moved to Atlanta, are you moving, thinking about Nashville? Like what's, when you think about like the most formative experience of having to do this, like moving and making new friends as an adult, what, what usually. T like what move comes to mind for you Gabs.

Gabby: Yeah. So I guess I'm in my head when I'm thinking about this topic, I'm not thinking about moving to a new city for uni, because I think university has a ton of opportunities. Like. The whole culture, your whole, your whole four first year there is like going to mixers and going to house parties and living with, you know, a bunch of kids. And, um, so I'm not talking about that though. That is a transition. That is, can be hard. Sometimes I'm kind of talking about when you moved to new city as a full fledged adults, and you're get trying to get a job and, you know, make new friends. And for me, I mean, automatically what comes to mind is when I, yeah, when I moved to Atlanta after college. So, um, After I graduated from college, I stayed in Madison where I went to school for about a year and a half. And then I moved to Atlanta, um, to be closer to my fiance at the time now has been Chris. And, um, that was just starting over. Like, I literally just packed my bag. I sold all my furniture. Um, I didn't have a mattress. And I took my very little savings cause who has savings and college? Well, maybe some people, but I didn't, um, and moved to Atlanta and it was hard. Like, uh, yeah. I remember just feeling so foreign all the time, especially when you move somewhere. That physically like geographically, your surroundings are different from the place that you left. Like, I don't know. I feel like that is such an out of body experience. It's not like you're moving to the neighboring city where it's like, the landscape is the same. The culture is the same. It's like when everything is different, like the highways are different, you know, I don't know all of that can feel so disorienting. And I, I think I mentioned this in, um, sorry, I don't mean to go off, but I think I mentioned this in the cross-cultural episode, but I read somewhere during that time that. I said one of the top three most traumatic events that you can go through in your adult life at, in that season of life is moving to a new city. Which I totally believe it's kind of like a sink or swim. Yeah. Mel: Yeah. I mean, potentially traumatic. Maybe not dramatic. Sure. There will be trauma. I mean, there's the potential for

Gabby: trauma. Yes. Yeah.

Mel: Yeah. I think when I think about, um, moving as an adult, and this is. A slightly different context for you than it was for you, but in some ways similar. So, and I think maybe this, in some ways we have an edge on this because we both moved to be with a partner or we were with a partner. So like one of the like big moves that we did was like two years. And maybe not even two years after Dave and I got married, we decided to move to London. And it's such a big, such a big Dale at the time we both had stable jobs. We both, you know, we were really happy, um, here with all our family around, um, well, not mine, but all of David's family around. Um, um, and I think, you know, Dave is such a home bird and I remember whenever we were first, like one of 'em, one of our first ever dates. When we, we kind of just knew that this was probably going to be at like, for each other. Um, I remember Dave said to me, like, we're sitting in the car and he's like, I just want you to know straight up. I'm never moving to Canada. I'm never moving to London.

Gabby: I was like,

Mel: okay. I mean, put your lay all your cards. DynaMed like, that's fine. Um, yeah, but he did kind of. Yeah, he compromised. And he was like, okay, well maybe we could go to London for a while and say, um, but that was a massive deal for him. I had already left. I had already left in London, but you can live in London once and leave and come back and you live in a different, totally different London when you come back because you maybe live in a totally different side of the city, which is like split into a million different little cities. Um, um, So that was a really different experience. I'm again, because the first time that I lived in London, I was a student and I was like on a bursary program with the salvation army, which was like, they were paying for my accommodation and they were paying for my tuition. And, um, I was getting like a living wage for the placement that I was working in when I did. You know, all of that kind of stuff. It was totally different too. We moved to London and only Dave had a job. Right. You know, we took on this apartment, we lived, we're living in an area that we didn't know. We've re like we had a couple of friends, but like when you have friends in London, it's not like you see, it's not like you see people. Like once a week, it's like, you know, you make plans a month in advance usually to like meet up or whatever it's different. So that's kind of the experience that I'm thinking about. That was tricky. Yeah.

Gabby: Yeah. I mean, yes, it definitely, I think it's different moving as an established couple or. Or as a family versus on your own, I will say when I moved to Atlanta, Chris was still touring most of the year. So he would come back to Atlanta and he would visit like one or two days a month. And the rest of the time I was by myself and that was intense. Um, but I, I always, I don't know. I think like when I think about moving, I always think about this. One piece of advice that has helped me a lot. Cause we then as a couple, we then moved to Nashville, uh, two years after three years, two or three years after living in Atlanta. Um, but I kind of think that sometimes when you do a big move, it can be really tempting to try and find all the ways that this place that you've moved to art is like your. Um, because it's a very natural human thing to do. You know, you're trying to like find some familiarities, find some creature comforts, but I kind of think that my best adjusting has always come with. I haven't tried to make, make the place that I've moved, that I've moved to the place that I left.

Mel: Yeah. He just take it as it is

Gabby: and be like, this is going to be different and I'm not going to try and make it look like home and I'm not going to try and, you know, pigeonhole it into an experience. I'm going to accept it as a new experience and take it for what it is in front of me. And I think I had to really do that with Atlanta because it, culturally, it was so different from the Midwest. It was like big flashy, south extravagant, bigger, a big city, instead of like a small, like farming town, a college town, Wisconsin, like it, it was a very different cultural experience. And I didn't always do that. Great. Like, you know, I think even too, like when seasons come around where you're like, you know, it's, it's the holidays, or, you know, fall is like a big deal in the Midwest because it's so beautiful. There it's almost like a its own kind of, uh, a holiday season. I remember being like, it was like, you know, Yeah. Yeah. It was like October in Atlanta and all the trees were green and it was like 95 degrees. And there wasn't any talk of like going apple pins. Like, I mean, there were pumpkins and trader Joe's, but like that's about it. And I was like, this sucks. Like where's the magic the season? What are you doing? Like, I don't know. I think some of that stuff can kind of be. Jarring when you realized that it is a different place and when you have attachments to things like that, I don't know, but yeah.

Mel: Yeah. I mean, I fully, like, I remember the first time I moved to London as a student, but like, I it's a real, it's a real shock to the system, but I was like, still, so. And now murdered by my, my new phone, like independence, I guess that I just like, I, this is a really Addy ground for thing to do or think, but I would just love nothing more than putting my headphones on and like, pretend I was in a movie soundtrack while I walked along. Like, you know, the sys bank or. Absolutely.

Gabby: Absolutely.

Mel: Um, you know, I was in some sort of like Richard Curtis movie. Um, and, and all of that is, is really, um, and even when Dave and I moved to London, I was just like, oh, we get to live here. This is the coolest city in the world. Um, which I, I wish I still Montana's tree. You know, it was also really like, oh mom, I, yeah, this is hard. And I didn't have a job. So I was like, you know, Dave was going to work and he was leaving really early for the commute. And then he was getting homely at, and I was like, I don't know, just like applying for a parking permit and go into. You know, job center to try and see what jobs are right there. And looking online, applying for jobs and all this kind of stuff. It didn't take me too long to get a job, but I feel like for me, that was it. Like, that was a really grinding thing to that whole experience was finally having a job, which for me, and this has always been the case is that, um, My job has, has often been, especially in the city, um, has been where my friendships have been made, you know? Yeah. Yeah. So when I got that job, it kind of, especially because of the job that I was in, I was working for the princess trust, which was all, you know, like, um, young adults in their twenties and thirties, like, um, Working in working in this charity. And, um, and it was a really, really awesome social organ, like social staff kind of culture. So that made a huge difference to me. But again, like I had to decide that I was going to engage with that.

Gabby: Yeah, totally. Totally. Because I

Mel: could've just been like, no, I've got a husband. I'm just going to go home. I'm not going to go to the pub after I'm not going to join the like charity softball team. I'm just gonna, you know, go to work and come home. But I had to kind of actively choose to engage with, with them.

Gabby: Yeah. Yeah. I was going to ask you what, like yeah. Cause I, I found. The job hunting process, very, very intense for me. And I did eventually find a job. Um, that was great. I think after three months of being in Atlanta, but I kind of wanted to pick your brain on like what the job searching process is like, was like for you and also. Was the community culture aspect, like part of what drew you to that specific job or?

Mel: Yeah, I don't know. No, I mean, I was just desperate for a job.

Gabby: Yeah, sure. No,

Mel: totally. Um, the job, the job fighting like process started months before we even moved because we, we both wanted to have a job to go to when we, like, when we had decided to move, Dave happened to. He interviewed for a job, like flew over, interviewed, came back, got the job. So we kind of had, we knew we had one income, so we were happy enough to kind of move based on that. But then I, I went over and interviewed for something came back. Didn't get it. Um, Or just applied for jobs and never heard anything. Yeah. I find that really difficult and I was like, what is going on here? And, um, I guess it's just so, so competitive in a big city like that. And so many jobs that I was like, I was going for all sorts of things. I was trying to like, uh, at the beginning I was like, Quite narrow in terms of, well, I don't really want to like travel too far around to like commute too far to go to work. But by the end I was like, whatever mine, I widened, widened my search take time. Um, but then this job just kind of happened to come up. Um, and it was, it was actually the perfect, perfect job for me. It was at the time and it was, um, And the, and the culture, like there was probably, I would say like a hundred people working in this, in this building and it was one of the coolest, like a real like Mary Poppins type street and London. So like one of those like Crescent, uh, straight it's like big white terrorist tying houses. Um, but we're like, when you go into them with like offices and stuff, um, And everyone was just really cool and, you know, London knee and from all over the place and like cared about young people. Cause that's what the princess trust, um, organization was a byte. And, um, yeah, and like, you know, like my, the team that I was in, I got to know the girls that worked in that team and, you know, within, within like six months, Going to like one of their weddings and like, you know, then I got pregnant and my other coworker, we were pregnant the exact same, exact same time. And then, um, you know, there was like a football or a softball league that charity league or charities would play against each other. And Dave, Dave signed up to the one with the print, like art princess trust team. And, um, so the two of us would go and we'd just get everyone would just get beers and go to the, um, go to these like. Charity tournaments and stuff like that. And that was so much fun. And, you know, I see even like, even to this day, I am still friends and still say the people that I worked with in that job, you know? Um, that's so cool. And yeah, they were. Yeah, they're amazing.

Gabby: Yeah. I mean, I think the job, the job finding portion of moving to a new city, cause sometimes you do have a job already lined up, but I think, I think plenty of people move places and like kind of do what we did. Like find something when you move there. Cause you're moving for another reason. Um, but I remember feeling. Especially before I found a job. So I worked, I worked so many part-time jobs until I found something more stable. I remember working at Madwell as many hours as I could get. Uh, I was, I went on care.com. It was like a babysitter around town. Um, and I remember feeling like, just so. So I was like, I don't, I can't focus on finding friends right now cause I'm just trying to pay my bills. And that was kind of a lonely place to be where you're just like going from job to job and knowing that it wasn't going to be forever, but also like, wow, when is this going to end? Um, and what am I going to do? Things that I enjoy. And also the other part of it was like, when I did get together with people. There were quite a few times where like they would pick restaurants or bars that were a little out of my price range, because I was like, I am just getting started here. Like I know you've got a great rent situation and you live with your friends and, you know, you're, you've, you haven't just had to do a cross-country move and pay for the gas and all of that. Uh, But I am just trying to like pay my rent, pay my internet bill, and I can't afford this $15 cocktail let alone the second, the next, the second $15 cocktail or split the bill. And that always felt like kind of an alienating place to be as well where you're like, I know this isn't going to last forever, but financially I can't afford to have friends right now. And that was like, kind of like a. Yeah, what I ended up doing and how does, I mean, this is what I did ended up doing. Cause I was like, I can't afford to go out.

Mel: Um,

Gabby: I. I started volunteering because I was like, no, one's going to ask me to spend money here. I'll spend my time. And then this way I can, like, so I ended up volunteering at a few different charities where they, they just needed someone to come in and like either clean or help, you know, manage an event or whatever. And I found that to be one of the best ways to feel connected and like have a, have a good chat with someone, you know, while you're. Giving out tickets or whatever the thing it was. Um, and I, so I don't know. I always think that's, uh, that was my top advice for when you move somewhere, if you can't afford to have friends volunteer, because it is a reality for some of us, especially when you're moving to big, expensive city, um, like your Atlanta's, your London's your new York's LA. It's it can get a little financially overwhelming

Mel: lately. Yeah. It's expensive to live in those cities for sure. And you know, like the things that feel really social, like going out for drinks after. You know, cheaper. So, you know, my rent is my rent is like triple what I was paying back in small town, Northern Ireland. And, you know, I mean, I know that like, oh mom, like rent and heist prices. It's like a whole other episode and those kids, but, you know, it's just. Yeah, it's hard to kind of think outside the box in terms of like Hardy, make friends, Hey, everyone. We wanted to take a quick break in this episode and let you know that we have a Patreon page NAI. Uh, you know, we love, love, love during this podcast. Each week I'm connected with you on our Patreon page is a way for you to get to hang out with us and for us all, to be together even more and help us cover the costs of running the podcast. So we can keep our sponsored ads to a minimum. Uh, it's just $5 or four points a month to access it. And we have some really exciting plans for spending more time if you guys there this year. So when you become a patron, you'll get access to our monthly, making an effort magazine where we're going to be sharing all of our. Recommendations for food and books and TV and music and what we're wearing and all that good stuff at you'll. Get a patron only extra video podcasts from us each month and an invitation to join us for our annual making an effort virtual cocktail party, where we get to hang out together, um, made each other more. So, if you want to join the making and effort gang, you can find a link to our patron and the show notes. Or you can go to www.patreon.com forward slash making an effort podcast. Can't wait to see you inside. One of my, one of my friend's alley. He used to work for me. Like she, um, she has used Bumble, like, so she's from the states and she moved to Northern Ireland and she has, but she has used Bumble in Belfast to, and she has made like friends, like with other ex-pats and stuff like that. Oh, that's so cool. So I know that there are other. Ways, if you have the stomach for, you know, a friend's friend set up, um, or a friend match in that, in that kind of way. But I, I think that there, you know, like there is like almost this hierarchy of like, what, what feels like is important to have in place before you can fail. Like you have the energy space to. Make friends and like have a social life. So like having a job, getting your bearings, like one of like, that's such a big thing as well. I remember like when I first moved to London and I was living with my friend a stale, she was just like, get the bus everywhere. Just get the bus everywhere. Like don't, especially in London when he could take the underground, she was like, honestly, you'll get to do the study so much better if you take the bus. Um, because you get to like see everywhere that you are and you realize that actually it's not really that far between tube stops. And maybe I could just walk these things or I could take a bus and you kind of get to experience the city more when you're on like public transport and stuff, rather than. I dunno driving or whatever, but, um, that would like, that would be one of like, if you're in any city, um, and you, you know, like maybe it's not even an option to not do this, but like I find taking public transport, especially the bus, like such a cool experience to get to know where you are and get your barons and like, um, cause I think all of that matters whenever you're away. Like. Um, knowing your surroundings a bit more and feel CF and those surroundings is and recognize things is really

Gabby: important. Yeah. Like the repetition of seeing the same place over and over again actually does like mentally establish a pattern. Even if you're not cognizant of it at all. And I even think like having your little routines, like when I think back on that move specifically to Atlanta, where I had so much alone time, I always think of like the little habits I cultivated, like. The running trail. I was like, well, I guess I'm running because there's nothing else to do. And it's free and I don't have to pay for a gym, but like, you know, I think of the running trail, I think of, you know, the little barbecue place that was like around the corner from my. My apartment that I used to go to, or the waffle house, it was down the road and be like, I don't know. You just, I think kind of creating places that you're willing to go back to that are part of your own little ecosystem will make you feel more yeah. And attached to a place. Yeah. When we,

Mel: if you can kind of do that. When I was a student in London, across the street from our flat was like a little Turkish grocers, like. Um, this, this Turkish family ran it and they used to sell cigarettes for like 20 pay like singles. It was the best thing. Cause I was like, no, I'm not, I'm not a smoker. I don't smoke, but I will have, you know, after a night I'll go and buy like three single cigarettes, 60 paid, but say, yeah, they like, they were, they ended up being like really. Good friends and fight for my flatmates. I ended up dating one of the guys that worked there and oh my God. Yeah. Yeah. Fun. Yeah. It was just, just getting to know it. Yeah. Getting to know your area. A little bit, uh, you know, like creating those familiarities for yourself. Um, but it is hard. It's really hard and it can be lonely. And I think, especially if you're talking about moving to a big city to have the experience of. Feeling like you're part of a community is really hard unless you're willing to really put yourself out there. I just, I just don't think it comes to you or like lands in your lap, you know, like you've got to join a sports team or you've got to go to a church if you want to do that. Or, or like volunteer or whatever. Like you do have to put yourself out there. If you're, if you want to cultivate some sort of sense of community, um,

Gabby: For sure. Yeah, I know there's no, there's no real way around that. Is there? No, no, but maybe it would, it's just helpful to hear that everyone has to do it at some point, and it's not like you're the odd ball out for having to like put yourself in this uncomfortable, you know, situation where you don't know anyone it's like everyone, everyone does have to do that at some point. And

Mel: I think there's something about living in a big city where that's almost like. Everybody everybody's in the same boat as well. So there was kind of like, I don't know, we died, definitely felt like there was a shared mutual feeling of like, we're all kind of passing through the city and this like exciting period of our lives kind of thing. Like none of us really feel like we're going to be here forever, but we're here and I like, let's just make the most of it. And yeah. See it for what it is, rather than thinking that we're creating like lifelong homes and this big shirt, you know? Yeah. So there was a little bit of like, uh, I think big studies, do you do have that kind of understanding with people that we're all just kind of transient, you know? Hmm.

Gabby: Interesting. Yeah. I, I think it's interesting because, um, You know, ultimately, so we lived in Atlanta for like almost just shy of three years. And, um, I remember so like we ended up moving to Nashville because we never actually ended up feeling fully settled there. We were like, we gave it our best shot and we actually still like some of our best friends that we go on vacation with that we like would love to live near. Are still in Atlanta, like Atlanta was great to us. Like we hadn't met a ton of amazing people. Um, I miss the food culture there so much. Like that's the other thing you get with a big city is you just get restaurants, even if you can't afford to eat the

Mel: appetizer. Yeah. Um,

Gabby: so like, there's, there's plenty that I missed, but I remember thinking, yeah. You know, we've been we've, we've given it a real, a real try and we're still don't feel settled here. And so we ended up moving to Nashville cause it's a smaller town or a smaller city I should say. Um, and just felt a little bit more homey. And it has been in all of those things for us, but I do kind of think that. Well, so I was going to say is like, I do think that homesickness is part of the process of moving. I think that's what, like, I have a few friends, like who have reached out recently or like I'm moving. Do you have any advice? And. What I told them was like, you didn't make the wrong decision just because you're homesick. Like you will be homesick at some point. And it doesn't mean that you threw it all away or that you made the wrong decision or that it's irreversible like homesickness as part of the journey of moving. And that's that's okay. But I do kind of think too. If you're still not feeling settled in a place fully after some time and after like even making friends or finding a job, you like, yeah. That's okay. Don't yeah. They were like, we weren't even miserable. I would just say we just didn't feel settled. You know what I mean? Like, we didn't feel like this was where we were. We wanted to be long-term and that's okay too, but I'm like so grateful for. Everything we learned there and the people we met there. Um, and we learned a lot too about like learning, to be able to trust yourself, like trust ourselves about like, Hey, you can do something really hard, like move across the country. And. And you can do it and you won't die. Such a bad-ass like you did that. And like you worked three jobs and you had no friends and now you're in their weddings. And like that, there's something about that where you like, can look back on this, everything you've accomplished in that season and feel really proud of yourself for yeah. Yeah.

Mel: I agree. Yeah, it's definitely, it's definitely, um, one of those ones where you have to hold your nerve because it doesn't, it is. It isn't ever easy. But it's most, most of the time, I would say it's worth it. It's worth it for sure. The experience of getting away, being independent, doing something new you, haven't only yourself to kind of rely on for, um, all the, all those big things, you know, find a job, find a place, getting settled, getting familiar, making friends. Yeah.

Gabby: I w I want to pivot briefly before we wrap up this episode. And you pick your brain about, cause like we've talked a lot about moving to city as like a single person or like as part of a couple, but without any kids, um, moving to a new place with kids. I don't know if I have any concrete advice about that and I wanted to pick your brain about yeah. Have you had to do that? I don't think so.

Mel: Right. No. Cause we, we, I got pregnant with Levi when we were living in London and then like when I was like six months pregnant, we decided we didn't want to have, we didn't want to have a baby in the study. We wanted to move near family and for support and stuff. Um, that was just a. Our call, like we just wanted to do that, which is so ironic because it was literally, it was like we had been London for just over a year, I think. And Dave had just started to like fail cells and he's like, I really quite like it here. And then I was like, no, no, no, no. We're moving home and productive. So yeah, no, we haven't, we haven't done that. You know, I think that it's where, I mean, you and I are kind of watching our friend do that at the Gabby: minute. I was thinking about Angie as well, and she's Mel: crushing it. She is crushing it, but we're kind of going through all of that. Um, like we're witnessing her. Move to a nucleus, um, way across the country with like literally no friends, no family there. Like nobody, she knows with her, with her husband and her two kids. And, um, it's so brief. Like I just Marvel at hybrid, if it is. And, and the kind of roller coaster of not just navigating your own feelings about being with your community and your people and the people that really know you, um, I guess there's something so like, oh, so something's so important if I. Bana Ryan people that just are your people that know you, that you don't have to like explain things to. Um, but not just to her navigating that, but also her holding the space of her children here also navigating that and messing their friends. Like it's such a big, such a big thing, but I also can see how incredible it has been before. They're family, you know, not to like overstep and talk about them. Gabby: But I was thinking about Angie too. Like when you're like, when I, I was thinking about this topic, cause I was like, you know, people do cross country or like, you know, Big moves with their family all the time. And there could be one in our future. I don't know. I'm not right now, but that is going to be like, that is its own challenge in and of itself is like, you don't have the flexibility of like, sure. I'll stay for another hour and grab a drink or, you know? Yeah. I've got like a quick minute after work or none of that stuff. Like you have to, it's already hard to make friends as a. A parent who has responsibilities beyond just looking after yourself. Um, But I just even think when you're trying to make friends and, and try and yeah. Make sure your kids are doing great. I mean, if you guys have any thoughts about that stuff, if you have experience with that, actually you should just write in, because I think that. We can, we could even share it on our stories or maybe even like in a future episode, we could share some of your advice because I think people would really enjoy hearing your Mel: perspective. You know, if, yeah. If you've got any, like anything that's been helpful for you, if you've moved. You know, whether it's been moved as a single person or a couple or a family. Um, and you want to write in and share, because this is something that has come up for a lot of our listeners that they've wanted to hear about from other people. So we would really love to hear from me. You can email us at hello at making an effort, podcast.com, um, or just go to making an effort podcast.com hit the content. PH, and you can see all the different ways that you can get in touch with us. Um, and we'll be sure to, to read your emails. Um, but yeah, hang in there, all you people who are navigating life in a different country, different city, trying to sell and hang in there. We know what it's like. It's hard you have got this. Um, yeah, uh, as always guys, thanks so much for less than, uh, you know, you can get in touch with us. On our email. hello@makinganeffortpodcast.com. Both Gabby and I are on Instagram And we will see you next time for more making an effort. Goodbye. Bye.